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They are the modern version of the old motorway 'Middle Lane Owner's Club' or MLOC (Hemlock). Get it?

Local roads are now a mix of 20 MPH and 30 MPH speed limits. They are badly signposted and nobody knows which is which, so they go half way - 25 MPH. In 30 limits they do 25, which would get a fail on a driving test for not making progress. Then in 20 limits they do 25, which is speeding and breaks the law. Both are wrong.

The problem is that councils are using by-laws to reduce the national urban speed limit by piecemeal. If it was government policy it would require an act of parliament.

So make it so. Pass an act that the new urban limit is 25 MPH and have done with it. Get rid of the 20 limits and all the speed bumps, speed cushions, sleeping policemen, rumble strips, chicanes and smiley / frowny signs and sort it out.

Is the 20 mph in force all the time or only whem schools are openin and children are walking to school?

Many drivers roond here don't even observe the 30 mph speed limit never mind the 20 mph. They seem to think because they have passed their driving test they
can go at any speed they like. And the number of cars with defective lights. Alot of drivers just get in the car and hope everything is working.

I too would like to see the end of sleeping policemen, lane blockers, and especially those sodding mini roundabouts that three quarters of drivers don't seem to understand.
And 25 is about the right speed anyway.
Cruiser, we have lots of drivers like that around here.

We're starting to get a lot of mandatory 20mph limits down here, and not just outside schools.

And they've even just wheeled out 30mph limits locally in Buckhorn Weston from last month, which is a bit of a laugh as you can't go any faster than 15mph through there anyway, the roads are so narrow and twisty ....

all of central London is now 20mph - which under normal circumstances wouldn't be an issue because it's not often you can go faster that 5mph... but at the moment with Covid and less traffic and roads empty it's mad that you can't drive 30mph. But they're doing it for fuel emission reasons (I think?) The slower the less you have to accelerate the less exhaust fumes? But I stand open to correction on that one.

I think 30mph is absolutely fine for most areas, but agree that in areas close to a school / playgrounds it should be reduced to 20.

But I'll also admit to being a lawbreaker and I often am over the 30 limit when the roads / traffic allow and regularly find myself at 40

TheOstrich wrote:And they've even just wheeled out 30mph limits locally in Buckhorn Weston from last month, which is a bit of a laugh as you can't go any faster than 15mph through there anyway, the roads are so narrow and twisty ....

It did make me smile in North Yorkshire a couple of years ago when I passed a national speed limit sign (60mph). The road we were on was twisty and very narrow; you'd have had to be a bit crackers to go more than 25 on it.

Crommers, we have loads of those roads as well - and the scary thing is that some people do drive along them at breakneck speed; how they manage to get to their destination in one piece is beyond me!

meriad wrote: But they're doing it for fuel emission reasons (I think?) The slower the less you have to accelerate the less exhaust fumes?

Ah, yes, that old chestnut.

So let's see. If you drive 10 miles at 30 mph it takes 20 mins, if you do the same distance at 20 mph it takes 30 mins. Your engine, therefore, runs 50% longer at 20 mph than it does at 30 mph. It's simple maths.

At 30 mph I can run in fifth or fourth (very few gear changes) at an average of 1500 rpm (revs per minute), depending on the terrain; at 20 mph I do roughly the same 1500 rpm in third and fourth but with loads of gear changes. For the same journey my total rpm is 30,000 at 30 mph whereas it is 45,000 at 20 mph. If each rev uses a similar amount of fuel regardless of speed, and it does, then I am polluting more at 20 mph.

The laws of physics dictate that driving slower is more polluting. Also, there is no evidence that driving at 20 mph is 'safer' except in certain circumstances such as near schools, but then only at times before, during and after. There is no need for a 20 mph limit past a school at 9 pm, as Cruiser points out.

I have asked my councillor for the before and after KOSI / RRTA figures for local zones and they do not exist. All we get is "Slower speeds make safer roads" but with no proof.

I guess that most of us would accept an urban limit of 25 mph so long as it was not enforced by humps, bumps and chicanes.