Finally the EU reaches reality and caves

[Suff]

Well done, Brunchkins, you have screwed us all good and proper.

Perhaps. But that is what Mrs S and I were saying back in 1975. What goes around comes around...

Time will tell. But at least the message is out there. Try and bully and you get nothing. They've already done a deal with Trump after saying they would fight him in the WTO.... Whilst I don't expect the climb down to be on the same scale, I do expect the position to change quite dramatically. I do not expect the UK position to change outside of a few cosmetic changes.

Although I could be wrong. However the way I read it is May has nowhere else to go whilst Barnier hasn't even really begun negotiating.

[Suff]

You're not satisfied. I'm not satisfied. Nobody's going to be satisfied. But that's life ....... [shrug]

I'm perfectly satisfied. Right now. Because I always knew that the only thing which really mattered was to exit the treaties and avoid the EEA. That we are doing.

Once that is done everything becomes a sovereign choice by the UK. We can say no and make no stick. Yep we have to pay the price of it, but that will be our choice too.

That is all I wanted. Because once that has been going for a decade or two, nobody is going to win the battle to suck us back into the EU, Schengen, Euro, Courts..... et. al...

My viewpoint is a bit longer than the next 6/12/18 months on this one. Which is why I'm OK with it right now.

[Workingman]

The only reason we're in this current state of trying to negotiate deals with an inflexible EU bureaucracy is because we have a weak bunch of politicians who have completely bottled it (all of them, including Boris, Cameron and May).

Ossie, that is what I and many other Remaiers have been hinting at all along. BTW I was using "you/Bunchkins" as pronouns for the collective, they were not aimed at you, any of you, as individuals.

We would have been fine with A50 being triggered with a note saying "See you in two years." and for us then to use those two years to sort things out.... in detail.

Unfortunately we have been sent into "negotiation" by a coalition of Remainers, who are genuinely concerned, and Leavers who are not totally behind the project. The whole thing has been badly managed from the day Cameron promised the referendum right up to the present.... and probably in to the future.

What I do not understand is why Brexiteers are so galvanised by the talks and a "deal" and the EU's stance. I would have thought that they would be incadescent with rage at us even looking at each other, but then consistency is not one of their strong points.