Vocal Voices

The campaigning is over, apart from a discussion thing on C4 at 9 pm, but no minds are going to be changed at this late stage, all we do now is vote.

I do hope that the turnout is high, not because it suits one side or the other, but if the vote is as close as predicted the overall percentage of votes for the winner needs to be as high as possible - either way. Getting 52% of a 50% turnout does not quite cut it.

It has been the very worst campaign I can ever remember during the time I have had the vote, but it will change the country, and politics, no matter who wins. It has exposed, once and for all, how despicable, self-serving and dismissive of the electorate our political parties actually are. I sincerely hope that they and their MPs pay for their behaviour in the years to come.

Whoever wins tomorrow had better deliver on their promises and lies, or else! The people will have spoken and every move they make will now be gone over with a fine-toothed comb.

I'm hoping that this has engaged a new generation of voters and that they stay interested and voting. I don't care what the result is, the engagement of the voters is way more important than any leave right now. Because if voters feel engaged they can, if they want, vote for a party which will push another out referendum if the lies come home to roost.

I do think there are some real howlers coming though. Turkey is a wild card, the treaty negotiations for 2020 are another.

The funny thing is that Brexit could usher in all the things that Leave is saying will happen. Britain is one of the key countries dragging back the integration of the EU. If we leave that integration can happen at an unprecedented pace, making the predictions of Leave come true. Conversely if we remain the predictions of Leave will take much longer to come to fruition.

I, also, am hoping for a vote in excess of 80%. At least that would settle any arguments about legitimacy. Sadly a very closely contested vote will drive arguments about legitimacy from whichever party is the loser...

Time to watch and follow. I'll be travelling tomorrow through a lot of it, I won't be home till just before the polls close and then I'll probably be up early for the first news. Unless Mrs S wants to stay up and watch the results come in.

Suff wrote:Because if voters feel engaged they can, if they want, vote for a party which will push another out referendum if the lies come home to roost.

Suff, let it go, please.

There is no such thing as a "Brexit" party, well, apart from that one MP UKIP mob, and both sides have lied their ar5e5 off. There are many more Remain parties: Tories, Labour, LibDems. Greens, Plaid, SNP. If Remain wins there will not be another referendum. If Leave wins ... there will not be another referendum - the EU will see to that.

And SNP was a nobody party with around 5 seats.... Lib Dems were a party in the 50's looking for their 60 mark.

Things change as the views of the people change. That starts with voter engagement.

I know that the major parties haven't worked this out yet. Especially the Lib Dems, but I would have thought you would have had a slightly broader insight into what the voters might do if they are incensed enough.

There are step changes in politics and I believe that this is one of them. Yes both sides have totally perjured themselves, but, in the end, it will be perception which wins.

SNP was still pretty low man on the totem poll until Cameron stood up in front of #10; immediately after the NO vote and basically told the Scots that the English voters issues were far more important than living up to the promises he had made so recently in written form.

The backlash to that was seen at the last election where SNP virtually swept the board. Voter engagement and Voter betrayal. I said it at the time and nobody wanted to take me on board with it. But the situation was clear and everyone I talk to up here is of pretty much the same mind.

As the post referendum situation unfolds, someone is going to pay the price of those lies and the voters are engaged enough to want to make them pay that price.

This is not over by a long, long, long shot and, whatever the result, the reverberations of the lies and the outcome of coming down to reality (whichever side wins); will drive those reverberations.

Suff wrote:I would have thought you would have had a slightly broader insight into what the voters might do if they are incensed enough.

Voters can do what the hell they like, but if the only political choices are the same, post the Ref, they, effectively, have the same choice as before.

However, if their choices are broadened, who knows?

Will there be an opening for smaller more focussed parties? Will FPTP have to be ditched? More coalitions? Proportional representation?

Yes, the possibilities, if the electorate are incensed enough, are endless.

About time.

Workingman wrote:About time.

We can hope.

The electorate, however, can suddenly decide the risk of not voting for someone they passed by before (UKIP for instance), is higher than the risk of voting for them.

It'll be interesting come the next election to see how they try and frighten us into believing that the economy is in a mess, austerity is a must and that we just can't vote for someone we want because we have to vote for someone we "need".

Suff wrote:It'll be interesting come the next election to see how they try and frighten us into believing that the economy is in a mess, austerity is a must and that we just can't vote for someone we want because we have to vote for someone we "need".

Leave would not do that, would they, or maybe ... !

They are all so trustworthy aren't they?

I shall be glad when tomorrow is over, whatever the result.

I have been thoroughly disgusted with the behaviour of some of our elected representatives, and I will never forgive them.
They have made me realise what a bunch of horrible creatures some of them are. They had better not come near me.

I'm sure that, at the next General Election, some of them will get their just deserts.

Aggers wrote:I shall be glad when tomorrow is over, whatever the result.

I have been thoroughly disgusted with the behaviour of some of our elected representatives, and I will never forgive them.
They have made me realise what a bunch of horrible creatures some of them are. They had better not come near me.

I'm sure that, at the next General Election, some of them will get their just deserts.

Totally agree, and hope so.

Workingman wrote:They are all so trustworthy aren't they?

Actually I'm being cup half empty, expecting a Remain vote and the inevitable games come the next election.

At which point I expect that the Tories will "play the game"