Vocal Voices

about the cost of the EU to the UK. Everyone had a figure and everyone else rubbished it and said it was wrong.

From €4.6bn per year to €18bn per year, the figures raged.

Today we find the truth. From the UK? Nope. From the parties of the referendum? Nope. It comes straight from the horse's mouth. The European Commisson.

Let us face facts. If the EU says it's loosing 12-13 billion Euros every year, then the UK was paying (over all it's payments), 12 - 13 billion Euros every year.

Now if we map that back, at current rates, That's about £220 million per week.

Now the £350m may not have been correct, but it's a damned sight closer to the true story than the one Remain was telling us.

I do love it when we see the reality. However late. I really hate it when the press just shrug it off instead of going in for the kill and gouging those who wanted to play down the true cost of the EU..

I also love the fact that the EU is whinging for "more" money at the same time as alienating Germany by promising "money and leniency" for the rest of the non Euro countries to join the Euro.

Why?

Because the Commission is painfully aware that it was a non Euro Zone country which left and that had the UK been in the Euro we probably would never have left because Project Fear would have been so much more effective.

I'm sure another few bits of news worth reading will fall out of the tree over the next few months....

What has really upset me is the antics of some UK politicians. We voted to leave (just), but some of them have no intention of sticking by that and imo intend to keep us as close to the EU as possible with the hopes of getting back in after a general election. What a shower they are.

£220m eh? It fails to take into account the approximately £90m a week the UK gets back in EU payments for all sorts of things, but let us stick with it and also work with the £165m Remain claimed was a nearer figure.

£350m - £220m = £130m

£220m - £165m = £55m

It makes Leave's lie 2.4 times bigger than Remain's lie. Glad I could clear that up.

Cromwell wrote:What has really upset me is the antics of some UK politicians. We voted to leave (just), but some of them have no intention of sticking by that and imo intend to keep us as close to the EU as possible with the hopes of getting back in after a general election. What a shower they are.

Could that possibly be that the polls, and yes we know they are crap if they do not match our own desires but bear with me, are shifting against Brexit. Some 51% of us would now like a second opinion on the deal on the table, against 34% who would take anything on offer. Then there is an ORB poll showing that only 37% of us think that the government is doing a good job with Brexit negotiations.

The latest stirring by May of the cold rice pudding that is the Cabinet has not exactly inspired confidence, has it?

WM, you misunderstand me.

This is not a figure the UK government gives before the handbacks and the games and the shadow boxing of EU finance.

This figure is the NET sum the EU will lose when the UK leaves.

That is totally crystal clear. The UK PAYS between €12bn and €13bn per year for membership of the EU (up to £220m per week). Something the UK only uses in part and in exports, something it uses less than 50%. In fact it is getting close to being under 40% for exports.

You can't do the usual trick of "taking away" handbacks from this figure. Because this figure has ALL of that factored in.

Farage has said, for at least a decade, that we are being lied to about how much we pay in. I have been pointing out, for over a year, that if you really drill down into the muddy mire of EU payment statistics, that the UK pays WAY more than France and close to what Germany pays.

Now the figures are out there. Let us also not forget, that even after paying €13bn, everyone else in the EU can request EU funds to support their own infrastructure, whilst the UK gets penalised because of our "rebate"...

Some Rebate. We're still the second largest net contributor and we still get shafted at every turn.

But at least the reality is now out there.

What the UK adds to the EU in terms of political clout and other economic benefits will become clear as the years go on post Brexit. But I know who has the MOST to fear from that and they all have a day job in Brussels....

Workingman wrote:Could that possibly be that the polls, and yes we know they are crap if they do not match our own desires but bear with me, are shifting against Brexit. Some 51% of us would now like a second opinion on the deal on the table, against 34% who would take anything on offer. Then there is an ORB poll showing that only 37% of us think that the government is doing a good job with Brexit negotiations.

Possibly, but what caught my eye was Tony Blair, who said that we need not have a second referendum, but prhaps a general election result could be enough to reverse Brexit, which is what I said might happen some months since.

Kick the can down the road, keep as close to the EU as possible, come up with word mangling on your EU position and after the election say that the GE result is a rejection of Brexit and we are staying in. This is what TB hopes for anyway.

I don't really think there is much appetite for a second referendum on leaving - what's the point. We voted to leave, now the politicians should concentrate on the job of leaving. Though their efforts do not (to put it mildly) fill anyone with confidence.

In my opinion, some politicians are now playing a dangerous game, and will live to regret it. At its very
worse, It could possibly be the end of democracy, as we now know it, - perhaps not such a bad outcome.

What can the population do, if they become absolutely fed-up with the way the elected representatives
are behaving? The answer to that will probably be revealed in the next general election. The very worst
outcome could be a modern-day version of something like the French Revolution. All that I can say to the
politicians is, "For God's sake, remember that you were elected by the population, just to look after their
best interests, and if you don't do that then expect serious repercussions".

According to the polls there is an appetite for another referendum, the rub is that no party in its right mind will ever offer it, so enter Toxic Blair.

He and other Remainers, in all parties including the Conservatives, would love another GE, that is if it comes before March 2019. A new government would then be free to cancel A50 and walk back into the EU.... or so they think. It would not surprise me one iota if such a scenario played out, even from the Conservatives, as nobody really wants to take over the mess the Brexit negotiations have become.

If the election comes after Brexit it will go down as the only one no party wanted to win. I would laugh the backside out of my breeches if parties failed to put up candidates in some seats to ensure the other lot got in.

I just hope we can depart the EU with a good outcome as I really believe this is the right way to go for the UK.

I am done with politics. I have always been a natural Conservative until David Cameron became PM. He and George Osborne had little regard for the average working family on a low income. Osborne's ill thought out budgets were evidence of that. Following her early speeches ,I thought perhaps Theresa May would be more inclusive. Unfortunately this is something she has not been able to achieve so far. Jeremy Corbyn looks like a kindly old granddad but he presides over a party of bullies who would get rid of any MP who challenged their mindset. The Liberal Party has very little say, other than Vince Cable, who perhaps has too much to say, particularly with regards to a second referendum. As for UKIP, I did vote for them but would not do so again. I still think Nigel was best placed to negotiate Brexit, but he put his feet up far too soon.

If there was another general election I would have no idea who to vote for, perhaps I will not bother. I should imagine quite a lot of voters will be facing a similar dilemma.

However much we play around with figures, the fact is we were net contributors to the EU on a massive scale - to the extent that Junker has now told the other 27 they will have to fill the gap in the next fiscal period or else because there ain't no slowing the gravy train - budget cuts are unthinkable.

I gather the Eastern bloc aren't happy bunnies about that ....

The EU will rue not offering Cameron concessions when he tried to negotiate with them.

I'm still a resolute Brexiteer - out at any cost remains my mantra. Nothing has persuaded me that there is any future remaining in that bloated and overbearing bureaucracy. And when we do finally get out, there's a few politicians I can think of who should be invited to move to the Continent if they're that keen on it - they'll be no great loss.

I see that Davis and our clueless chancellor, are off to tell Germany why the UK banking needs to stay in the EU.

I feel a mail coming on to Davis. Explaining just what all those Euro bailouts meant to the German banking system.... Clearly he has no clue..