Lie after lie

[cromwell]

There was an interesting letter in the Telegraph today from a gentleman in Sale.
He stated that his 94 year old cousin had died, and the GP had put Covid down on the death certificate despite the fact that the lady in question had no symptoms, had tested negative and the GP hadn't been to see her.
The family insisted that the falsehood be removed from the death certificate and the GP did so and apologised. Personally I would have been asking the GP why it was put on the certificate if it wasn't true?

This mirrors the death of one of our neighbour's father, who was in the last stages of Parkinson's disease when admitted to our local hospital. He died and on the death certificate was "Covid related pneumonia". What's that?
He either had Covid or he didn't and that wasn't what killed him anyway - that was Parkinson's.

I know there is a virus out there, I know it kills people. I am waiting for the jab myself. But imo there is no doubt that the Covid death figures are being deliberately inflated and it is absolutely disgraceful.

Meanwhile Nadim Zahawi (Government minister) says that vaccine passports are "not the way we do things in the UK". Neither is putting people under virtual house arrest, closing pubs and restaurants, making it illegal to go on holiday and all the rest.
Not to mention that the government has already got firms working on the idea of vaccine passports!

[Workingman]

Cromwell, this is obviously getting to you more than most of us, but your questions are pertinent nonetheless.

A lot comes down to one of the questions many people are asking; "Did the person die 'with' or 'of' Covid-19? It is a tough call for the doctors. Take pneumonia for example. It is a known illness associated with C-19 and I suppose the question to be answered is whether the person would have caught pneumonia had they not contracted C-19? Same goes for things brought on by C-19 such as kidney or liver failure and low blood pressure.

With the restrictions, they are only temporary and parliament has to review them regularly, but some things had to be done. They will go, eventually. However, with the passports things will be taken out of any country's hand. They might not be used internally, as Zahawi says, but for international travel they might well become necessary. Airlines and some countries might forbid travel without one - the UK is part way there with the latest restrictions..

[TheOstrich]

Meanwhile Nadim Zahawi (Government minister) says that vaccine passports are "not the way we do things in the UK". Neither is putting people under virtual house arrest, closing pubs and restaurants, making it illegal to go on holiday and all the rest.
Not to mention that the government has already got firms working on the idea of vaccine passports!

When I was vaccinated last Saturday, Crommers, and handed my "card" with the first jab sticker on it, the doctor who jabbed me (he was one of our local surgery GPs as it happened), did remark "hang onto that, when you get your second sticker after the booster jab, it'll be your Covid passport ......" And the card actually states: "make sure you keep it in your purse or wallet".

We are really in unknown territory here, and I can certainly see a scenario where you'd need one for foreign travel in future, just like a yellow fever vaccination certificate. Whether or not we might eventually get regulations whereby you'd need to evidence one before (say) booking an event in this country, i.e. Glastonbury or a Premier League game, who knows?

[Workingman]

"Covid passport" is a lay term, thrown about like confetti by all and sundry, for a card with the date(s) of your Covid jabs. It has no meaning in a true "passporting" sense and never will have unless we go into full "Stasi" mode. Even if that did happen an internal passport would be utterly useless in such a mobile and densely populated country; and events / meeting places / forms of transport already have the right to refuse or allow entry to anybody and for any reason.

It's the media messing about, again, and unless you are thinking of going abroad I do not think that there is much to get hung up about.

[saundra]

Government don't have a clue on numbers
They are meaningless just need to frighten the masses
They are even allowing illegal immigrants to register with a doctor to get an covid vaccination And not being charges against them pathetic

[victor]

I am inclined to agree with Crommers that the numbers are "massaged".

How can someone be given Covid as the cause of Death when they have been tested negative have no symptoms and not even be seen by a Dr ?

Don't think this can be ONE isolated case in the whole Country

[Workingman]

Ah, another from the Daily Mail book of myths and legends?

"Man run over by bus within 28 days of a Covid test = Covid death."

"Woman burned to a cinder in a house fire within 28 days of a Covid test = Covid death."

A medical doctor needs to sign a death certificate with "the medical cause of death" so the idea that a doctor was not seen is nonsense.

Things such as obesity, asthma, bronchitis, covid, pneumonia etc., are known as "relevant information" and are factually correct and cannot be omitted from a death certificate. That does not equate to them being the "cause" of death. The bus and the fire were the causes.

[Suff]

There was an initial issue with the register of Covid infections and the register of deaths. The authorities, in the first instance, took the simply path of cross checking Covid infections with deaths. Easy, job done you would think. Except the UK does not track Covid recoveries. leading to around 6,000 cases to be removed from the list and a 28 day cut off to be put on the list.

So whilst the DM is correct in one fact, it is not correct overall. Should a person detected with Covid, be run down by a bus, within 28 days, they will still be recorded as a Covid death on the covid stats. Because they do not check the cause of death, they check the death and the date and cross check the list of Covid infections. This is a prudent because as a doctor may not register the cause of death as Covid even when a person is infected. they may register pneumonia or other causes.

Given the current number of deaths, I doubt it is overly warping the stats. But it does make a good DM "screaming headline" doesn't it.

[cromwell]

The whole point was that it wasn't a paper story but a reader's letter.
Anyhow, we shall see. If flu deaths plunge to zero this winter it will be interesting to read the explanation.

And byw, the power mad at the HoC are moving the goalposts again. The famous Jeremy Hunt has said lockdown should not be lifted until covid infections dip under 1,000. Are they aiming for zero covid? Waste of time if so.

It's not so much the virus that is getting to me WM as the antics of politicians who seemingly find it difficult to tell the truth, stick to a deadline, who are continually shifting the goalposts and who have managed to terrify the population into virtual insanity.

[Workingman]

I understand, Cromwell, and you have my sympathy.

Here's one for the geniuses at T&T.

The ex visits homes she manages and was in the office of one on her own doing some record keeping when she got "pinged" meaning she had to have a test = negative. The thing is that none of the staff or residents are positive (all recently tested) and no one else got a ping. It must have come from someone in the ginnel adjacent to the office window.

So, why was that person out and about and do the T&T people know who it was - they should? If people are not going to stick by the rules and also if those rules are not being enforced then why are we bothering?