A failure to listen

[Suff]

Is what is driving the whole Greek situation today.

Wolfgang Schäuble, Germany’s hardline finance minister, commended Mr Tsakalotos for his “more conventional” approach but urged Athens to start implementing reforms immediately, even before reaching an agreement on a new bailout, as a way of rebuilding trust between Athens and its eurozone partners.

Sorry Herr Schäuble, but you are not listening. Tsipras requires Debt Relief to have a hope in hell of getting the reforms through Government. So you have to ante up before he can deliver what is needed.

So the wheel turns and things will be, as they have always been this year, In conflict.

Meanwhile the Greek banks are closed and the Greek economy goes further in the crapper every day.

On the bright side the Greeks have finally admitted the Gas deal with Russia is worth £2bn and there will be a sizeable up front payment....

That would go a long way to prop up a new Drachma....

[cromwell]

I think it's the German mentality. Not so long since they wanted "oversight" of the Greek reforms. Understandable from a German point of view, massively upsetting from a Greek point of view. Which the Germans either don't see, or don't care about.

[Workingman]

Yet in other places the Eurogroup's President, Jeroen Dijsselbloem, is quoted as saying that the new Greek proposals are "thorough" and will pave a way for a major decision on Saturday... "whichever way".

Is this a sign that some of the others are getting a bit fed up with Germany's hard-line stance?

[medsec222]

It wont be easy either way, but perhaps the Greeks should get out of the EU while they have the chance.

[Suff]

Short Termism, the modern disease. In the short term they have more to lose. However in the long term the EU has more to lose.

Hence the current attitudes.

[Workingman]

So we go to Saturday, possibly Sunday.

[cromwell]

So the Greek people reject the bailout terms of the EU in their referendum.

So then their government accept the terms of the new bailout - which are worse than the terms of the old bailout - which the Greeks just rejected............

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My head hurts.

[Workingman]

Like most democratic referenda the Greek one is not binding.

So Tsipras goes to the Eurozone people and agrees with most of their demands. If they refuse he calls in the referendum. If they accept he has won some concessions from them. A win - win.

He is not as daft as the BBC's Peston and the rest of the media would have us believe.

[cromwell]

Complicated doesn't begin to describe this situation. According to the Andrew Marr show, Finland has now stuck its oar in and is threatening to torpedo any Greek deal. Why, I have no idea.

Then you have the (understandably) hacked off Germans wanting to give the Greeks what for, the French wanting to preserve intact zee great European ideal and Obama not wanting the Greeks to get pally with Putin.

The Greek weakness is that they have shown that they are desperate to remain in the Euro. That being the case the Germans have realised that the cards that the Greeks are holding aren't aces!

[TheOstrich]

According to the Andrew Marr show, Finland has now stuck its oar in and is threatening to torpedo any Greek deal.

Just posturing, because a little-known, secret, emergency EU rule (as per the Guardian yesterday), means that they don't have to get 100% of the Eurozone countries to approve the bailout, just 85% will do. If it's an "emergency".

I assume that somewhere in the background, there's another little-known, secret, emergency EU rule that if it's a "BIG emergency", then just 50% will do ....

In other words, they'll do whatever they want, despite the small countries.

Meanwhile, and interestingly, it certainly looks today as if the troika want their full pound of flesh ......