Can someone tell me

[Aggers]

It matters most of all because most of us quite like living in the UK as it is now. It took this country an awfully long time to get to a point where women even had the vote, where gay people could breath easily, where discrimination against Catholics and Jews is unacceptable.

So yes, it absolutely does matter to me and to most other people who live in this country as to who lives here.

Well put, Cromwell.

I agree most definitely with all that you say, and I'm sure the majority of Real English people do, too.

[Suff]

Crommers you go to a lot of what I thought, immediately, following the "multicultural" statement. But it didn't get to the crux of it.

Honestly I had two reactions when I read that. First I was somewhat irritated and secondly I wanted to laugh. It's such a trite, worn out, piece of political jargon that I honestly didn't think that anyone who has a good education and an awareness of the world would actually use that excuse to allow the politicians to hide what they are doing to our country.

Apparently I was wrong. Probably my irritation was due to the horrendous journey I had this weekend. Humour is the best response I guess.

So where is the ludicrous hypocrisy of the whole "multicultural" thing?

Well it comes down to the part that Cromwell stated in the "they do not believe in our values". Simply put, to be multicultural, you have a set of values and all cultures are tolerated within them and share in those values.

That is the ONLY way that multiculturalism can work. Multiculturalism is _NOT_ the vast majority of the population both tolerating and aiding and abetting bigoted, misogynistic, gay hating, rabid intolerants who bring heir attitudes and hatreds with them.

That is not multiculturalism, that is total insanity. In a world where a white person can be criminally prosecuted (successfully), for using the N word but Blacks use it more and more commonly to describe themselves, this is not multiculturalism. In a world where women are brainwashed, from birth, to be different, not to integrate and to go down the street covered in clothing which is not the norm, is not multiculturalism. That is imported bigotry.

In multiculturalism the minorities give up something of what they want and the majority bends to allow some of what the minorities want. THAT is a working multiculturalism.

Take the Gays. It was illegal. So we make it legal, with proviso to protect the physical health of young men. Then we give civil partnership and the ability to adopt. Is that enough. No they want marriage.. So we give them marriage, there is perfectly acceptable state marriage without including the church but do they accept that? No they go on trying to dismantle the church to meet their own political aims and goals.

That is not tolerance, or multiculturalism. That is bigotry and abuse.

We do not have a multicultural society. We have islands of bigotry abusing their leeway and that very small tail is wagging a very large dog. Some day that dog is going to bite it's own tail off. It may be painful but it won't be as painful as the disease which is spreading from it, infecting the whole and healthy body.

As for Boston? I have two daughters who live quite close to Boston. Neither will even enter the town now. Both have shopped there extensively and it is one of the places they like to shop. What they said?

"Boston is a place which is full of ignorant and abusive Eastern Europeans who don't like women and are unpleasant to them".

Mrs S thought they were exaggerating even though both of them are extremely tolerant people who hate any kind of discrimination. She simply could not believe that a town which we all know and have spent a lot of time in over the last 3 decades, could be like that.

These are Christians. Not the Moslems who throw Christians into the sea to drown when their boats are threatened.

350,000 crossed into the Balkans in January. Where are they doing to put them? Germany, if not Merkel, has finally realised the monumental mistake Merkel made. I wonder how foolish those Germans are now feeling who took their cars to Austria to get those "poor people fleeing oppression" back to Germany?

The original question was quite simple. The answer is, apparently, that the question has no merit....

[TheOstrich]

This thread touches on very emotive points, and I've thought more than once about whether I should post on it. Something acts to hold me back; what is it? The ingrained British sense of fair play? Or the fact that I live in a “big city” where the benefits of multiculturalism and diversity are trumpeted loud and hard by the local politicians and the Birmingham Evening Mail – and have been for many, many years. So if you raise any sort of protest or voice against these twin ideals, you – the native or ex-pat Brummie - is the one who is howled down. People are very, very loathe to say anything (unless you get them one on one behind closed doors ) so we have, in a way, a self-fulfilling prophesy – we are all branded as happily multicultural and embracing of diversity, when frankly, we are very, very leary about it.

If diversity and multiculturalism are such a great benefit, why do we need to be reminded constantly about it? If diversity and multiculturalism are such a great benefit, why has it not been universally accepted by the population?

I was away from this city for over 20 years before moving back, and I remember what the city used to be like – and it’s nothing like it is today. Despite all the bleatings from the local big-wigs and media, this is not a pleasant place to live. As I’ve said before, there are certain areas in which I simply feel very uncomfortable, even during daylight hours, because I am “out of place” and treated with suspicion. When I’m travelling around by public transport, and it doesn’t matter what time of day, there is a cacophony of foreign languages being shouted into mobile phones which makes me feel an outsider. So why can’t I “embrace” this? Is it a generational thing? A racist background thing? Both?

Actually – why should I have to “embrace” it? Things are happening in this country that the general population have absolutely no control or say over – and worse, they cannot even speak out publically about without opprobrium. What we really need is a good, honest and fair national debate about where this country is going – one in which I’d like the strident multiculturalists to pipe down and listen to other people’s views (and fears) for once. We will never develop any sort of cohesive society in this country without honesty, and honesty is a two-way street.

An old friend of mine was recently approached to take part in a Department of Media and Culture et al. lifestyle survey – I think the incentive was a book of postage stamps (first class!) and a £5 shopping voucher . He duly assented and a guy came round one afternoon to interview him.

“Ossie,” he said “one question really flummoxed me.”
“What was that, then?”
“He wanted to know whether I loved my country, on a scale of 1 to 10!”
“What on earth did you reply,” I laughed.
“I didn’t know what to say, so I said 7 out of 10” he replied.
“Ber-limey, I said, come and live up here”, (he’s in a rural area of the south-west), “I’d be asking the interviewer if I could give him a negative number! Minus 4 out of 10 would be my response!!”

And that sums it up for me. Underlyingly, I have no love for this country – what it has become, what it purportedly stands for, and where it is going. And somehow, I don’t think I’m alone in that …..

[Nanna]

You are not alone Os ..... Just look at Rochdale

[Aggers]

And that sums it up for me. Underlyingly, I have no love for this country – what it has become,
what it purportedly stands for, and where it is going. And somehow, I don’t think I’m alone in that …..

Ostrich, I must congratulate you. You have expressed exactly what I feel, and, from my experience,
what the vast majority of older and wiser people feel, although many of them, no doubt, hesitate from
expressing their views because it is nowadays frowned upon to speak so in this so-called multi-cultural
society that our wonderful, brainless politicians have introduced. Like you, I used to love our England's
green and pleasant land, but, to be honest, I shall not be sorry to leave it. It is nothing like the place
I was proud to be born in.

[Diflower]

Well personally, I want to cling onto life for as long as I possibly can, and will only leave kicking and screaming.
There is still so much to love and enjoy of this beautiful country, and its people.
Yes there are faults - there always have been.

[debih]

Double post

[KateLMead]

And that sums it up for me. Underlyingly, I have no love for this country – what it has become,
what it purportedly stands for, and where it is going. And somehow, I don’t think I’m alone in that …..

Ostrich, I must congratulate you. You have expressed exactly what I feel, and, from my experience,
what the vast majority of older and wiser people feel, although many of them, no doubt, hesitate from
expressing their views because it is nowadays frowned upon to speak so in this so-called multi-cultural
society that our wonderful, brainless politicians have introduced. Like you, I used to love our England's
green and pleasant land, but, to be honest, I shall not be sorry to leave it. It is nothing like the place
I was proud to be born in.

Well my question has really opened this post to the opinions we are seeing..I used to have an antique shop in Luton when I was in my late thirties..immigrants were settling into the communities and were made welcome by local residents, we had the joy of seeing their colourful shops and curry houses appearing in the town and these people were 'made to feel welcome. There was a feeling of respect and friendship that developed within both communities.Today as seen in our newspapers and on video, the town is a No Go area, it is a town where the stench of hatred fills the air, English locals live in fear and are second rate citizens in their own town and country. I was shown a video taken when "Britain First" who marched through the town carrying crosses, handing out newspapers. I have absolutely no time for this organisation however what ensued was frightening. Muslims screaming abuse 'This is our F town' it belongs to Muslims" 'Get Out you !!!!! "this town belongs to Muslims, it is our town" " this country will become Muslim!!' They screamed, shop keepers, gangs of Muslim men and women screaming at the one woman to cover herself!! they were screaming terrible abuse.. it was terrifying and the police stood by and did NOTHING. I have mentioned previously, fifteen years ago
We were visiting a dear Muslim friend in Golders Green he and my late husband always got onto politics. Our friend stated within twenty years Muslims would be active intent on conquering the world and Islam and Muslims will be the rulers. That was fifteen years ago, my husband laughed and told him not to talk nonsense..five years to go, it may take longer but I think our friends prophesy was not as nonsensical as my husband thought.,

[Kaz]

Kate, Luton does have its problems, and I don't deny there is some extremism there but honestly it isn't a no go area! My sister and her family live there, in a very nice detached house in a small cul-de-sac with neighbours of all creeds, and she works in adult social services in the town centre. They have raised two well educated, high achieving children there. She would agree it isn't the nicest of towns but it is far from how you describe, on a day to day basis.

[debih]

So much depends on what paper you read and choose to believe doesn't it.

Certain papers seem to forget that extremism and true religion are very different things. You do get the impression that some forms of media would have us think that all Muslims are terrorists. They aren't passing on news, just their racist views.


Sent from halfway down the stairs