Skills based training.

[Workingman]

Too late and not enough.

The government wants to set up courses providing students with about 20 hours tuition per week. That is not so bad. It also wants to give those on technical courses maintenence loans. That is not so good. This is all supposedly to give students the skills employers need in order to take them on....

The government has missed an open goal: again. You cannot give someone hoping to be an electrician, plumber, engineering technician, the skills they need in a classroom. They need to be in the world of work - at the same time.

By all means give the students 20 hours of tuition, but instead of loans pass the money to employers as an incentive to take students on as they start a course. Let them learn on-the-job as well as at college.

[manxie]

The only way to learn any trade or profession is the hands on aproach even doctors and vets etc have an apprenticeship the same as a chef or a carpenter, all have some hands on learning pro rata to their level of skills as well as lots of teaching.

Look at the numbers leaving university with a degree who cannot get work in their chosen field because the employer wants somebody with "experience",

We all to often hear of ex uni students with degrees working in fast food outlets or a supermarket filling shelves for this simple reason.

My view is pay the employer a subsidy and or a tax relief to take on apprentices and build the skills up that way, on the premise that they train and keep on the worker not just use the cheap labour after having taught the basics and then left to do a tradesmans job as the subsidy runs out.

Manxie xx

[Workingman]

You hit the nail firmly on the head there Manxie.

[AliasAggers]

My view is pay the employer a subsidy and or a tax relief to take on apprentices and build the skills up that way, on the premise that they train and keep on the worker not just use the cheap labour after having taught the basics and then left to do a tradesmans job as the subsidy runs out.
Manxie xx

That is my view too, Manxie.

Apprenticeships coupled with day-release technical education is the way to go.

[manxie]

When I served my two apprenticeships there was no such thing as going to college to sit at a desk.

In catering I was taught all the basics and started at the bottom making stocks for soups and meat/fish dishes , then I moved on to making individual dishes and I remember spending a whole 3 months just making curries, before moving on again to other dishes.

The same again in Butchery the first thing I had to do was operate the mincer or sausage mixer and then how to link the sausages and so on I don't think I used a knife in my first month and when I did it was to seperate fat from lean or to dice stewing steaks it all took time and my boss in butchery only allowed me to move on when I could recognise a cut of meat just by the size shape or grain of the meat.

Most of my first year was on these menial jobs and serving customers till I proved to him I knew what I was doing after that it onto went boning out the animals with the expensive cuts the last to be trusted with.

I am positive that anyone can learn the majority of trades this way.

I have great sympathy for the young today both girls and boys who cannot see much of a future other than sitting at a computer or answering a telephone and they will be the cream of the youth, there are so many being failed by the education system leaving without even the basic skills of reading and maths.

Another bugbear of mine is the lack of disipline throughout by the education system and parents and a very much over the top attitude of the do gooders of modern times, everything in moderation should be the rule.

Manxie xx

[AliasAggers]

Most of my first year was on these menial jobs and serving customers till I proved to him I knew what I was
doing after that it onto went boning out the animals with the expensive cuts the last to be trusted with.
I am positive that anyone can learn the majority of trades this way.

I'm not so sure that that method is suitable for all jobs, particularly those that require a good technical knowledge.

Another bugbear of mine is the lack of disipline throughout by the education system and parents and a very
much over the top attitude of the do gooders of modern times, everything in moderation should be the rule.

I agree here, Manxie. Too many things are "over the top" now, and discipline is very often a thing of the past.
Do-gooders often do more harm than good.

[Suff]

I was one of those who used ET to get onto another career path. It worked for me although it was not a very good program. I'd left college and wound up chopping and packing veg. I used ET as a method of gaining experience so I could become employable.

Then there is the industry abuse of government money. Which happened after I got a job. The government never follows up with it's programs to see if they need tweaking or even monitoring. Witness the warehouses stuffed with insulation in the UK because you can only get two of the three layers of insulation, subsidised by the government, into the rafters of the majority of houses. Hardly any surprise they were going for a tenner a roll.

I'm all for apprenticeships and training/college release to get our own people out of the rut and into jobs. But it needs to be comprehensive and managed. Two things the government suck at.

[AliasAggers]

I was one of those who used ET to get onto another career path.

What's ET ?

[Suff]

Employment Training Aggers. The youth version was YOP in the early 80's and became YTS later.

I got the princely sum of nothing, due to my wife working and my NI contributions having expired when I was in college and the privilege of spending 4 months training with CNC mills and lathes. However this allowed me to join an IT company as a placement for 6 months where I only got a sandwich for lunch and was brought backwards and forwards to work.

However, it got me a job. Can't see the current unemployed going for it though. Requires you to give up the best part of a year for the only return being an opportunity to enter (re-enter) the jobs market.

When you think about it, my wife was a teacher with a good salary. Theoretically I could have swept streets for a living. Fortunately, for us, my aspirations were a touch higher.