Revenge

[Suff]

If Leave does not win with a fantastic majority, that's it. Game over.

Can't argue with the logic of that.

Fundamentally the thing most likely to get the UK through a leave would be an immediate snap election where the people would get to vote in the MP's who they feel will best negotiate our OUT situation, with an election again, say, 12 months after the split has happened.

That, for me, would allow a Leave unity government as a single purpose government to get the very best situation for the UK during the negotiations.

That horribly loud thudding sound was me hitting the floor before I woke up from my daydream....

[Aggers]

We get two years, minimum, to negotiate our exit. .

Where did you get that from? It's the first time I've heard it.
I would have thought that if we vote to leave we could get out damn quickly.
What have we got to negotiate?

[Workingman]

It is in Article 50, Aggers.

In effect, the UK would continue to participate in EU business as normal, but not participate in internal EU discussions or any decisions on its own withdrawal.

However, our complete withdrawal could take longer, much longer. The final deal of a negotiated UK exit would need to be ratified by EU leaders via a qualified majority vote, and a majority in the European Parliament, and by the remaining 27 national parliaments.

June 23rd will not be Independence Day by any means.

[Workingman]

Fundamentally the thing most likely to get the UK through a leave would be an immediate snap election where the people would get to vote in the MP's who they feel will best negotiate our OUT situation, with an election again, say, 12 months after the split has happened.

Ah, but the candidates most likely to stand and win are the same ones as are in place now, and in the main they are Remainers.

A unity government, hmm. All of the major parties are Remainers. Any negotiations will be not to rock the boat too much.

I know it looks as though I am and 'agent provocateur', but I am not. If we do vote to leave it has to be a clean break and I do wonder where the negotiators for such are going to come from.

[Suff]

Aggers,

Before the Lisbon Treaty there was no viable way to exit the EU, well none that was documented. Article 50 of the Lisbon treaty set that out. Basically it was a direct copy (as was most of the Lisbon Treaty), of the Constitution which the French and Dutch voted out.

What it does is set the maximum time that a country can have to exit. Of course if everyone comes to the table and all the agreements are made, then the country could be out sooner.

During that time the country which is leaving is still part of the EU, still trades with the EU and still has to abide by the directives, until either 2 years are reached or a final resolution and agreement is made by the remaining 27 countries and the exiting country.

After 2 years, whatever the state of affairs, the country exits and then can apply trade sanctions or anything else it wants to the EU.

Very little has been said about this, deliberately by Remain and not very clearly by Leave.

The 2 years, however, allows the leaving country to arrange trading agreements with other nations outside the EU, to go into effect as soon as the 2 years are up.

Remain has been totally dishonest about that because, for the 2 years of separation, not that much would change. All the stories of doom and the end of the world on the 24th are just that, stories of doom. It's why I get so angry about the whole thing. If the government and the Leave campaign had honestly told the people all the in's and outs of how it would work; there would be a lot less fear and a lot more optimism and a real debate could have ensued....

[Suff]

I know it looks as though I am and 'agent provocateur', but I am not. If we do vote to leave it has to be a clean break and I do wonder where the negotiators for such are going to come from.

Not at all. You are asking exactly the questions which people should be asking themselves. I also wonder how much bloodletting there will need to be in order for that break to happen. Clearly Cameron would have to go and virtually immediately.

[Workingman]

I know it looks as though I am and 'agent provocateur', but I am not. If we do vote to leave it has to be a clean break and I do wonder where the negotiators for such are going to come from.

Not at all. You are asking exactly the questions which people should be asking themselves.

I know I am, but it is not only the people, the media and campaigners should also be asking, and answering, these questions.

I am incandescent that these things have been overlooked.

[Suff]

I am incandescent that these things have been overlooked.

In the mad rush to win no matter what the cost, what hasn't???

[Aggers]

Regarding this two-year business, why can't we just say, "knickers - we are getting out now, Amen" ?

[Workingman]

Regarding this two-year business, why can't we just say, "knickers - we are getting out now, Amen" ?

Could it possibly be that it is not just about us?

The negotiations are there so that neither side suffers more than it has to. If we do leave, a serious possibility, we have to do it on the best terms, for both sides.

Throwing the toys out of the cot helps nobody. If we refuse to play the game so will they, and that really would be to our disadvantage.