YESSSS, a Tory kicking!

[Suff]

Suff, spin it all you like, lay out your excuses and pledge your love for May, but she did the impossible - she won and lost at the same time. Suck it up. Her and that pillock Cameron have put the country in deep sh1t for party political purposes and I hope the country never forgets.

I'm not spinning anything. The Tories are still in power. Brexit is probably harder than it would have been under May alone. Scotland has finally been freed of single party politics which took over after Major. The pseudo "social" programme May brought in after her elevation to PM, which quite annoyed me, is a Dodo, sitting on the plate, waiting to be eaten.

What did I lose?

Those, on the other hand, who thought to derail Brexit, who sought to put Corbyn into power, crippled by minority and supported by SNP or the Lib Dems, what did they gain?

There is a lot of crowing going on right now. There will be a lot of tears over the next 2 years.

If you recall, or just go back and read, I have been fairly consistent. I had a hope for the Conservatives in Scotland. I had a hope the Tories would win a mandate but even if they lost the election I would not lose, personally.

I lost nothing last night. In fact I have gained an eventual Tory leadership challenge. In time, when it is deemed safe to do so. In fact I've gained a strong opposition, for the moment. Something I did agree with you, was good for the country.

Personally I don't need to spin anything. As I have not lost anything. The Tories? They're losing a leader. May? She's lost it all. Brexit? Not lost. The economy? I don't have to put up with Corbyn borrowing his way into the record books to fund a splurge on things which will make no difference whatsoever.

In the end, whilst I would have preferred a Tory Majority of 25 - 45 seats, I got what I wanted. A Conservative government which will lead us into Brexit.

Now here's a thought. How many Tory Leavers lost a seat? How many Tory Remainers lost a seat? Because that balance is going to make a big difference to how the next 2 years go. I haven't seen any media do that calculation yet but it will come. As far as I saw it was all Tory Remainers who got the boot. Which makes the party even more EUskeptic and it just coalitioned with core EUskeptics.

This will be heralded as a triumph for people power. Farron will bleat about stopping Brexit, Corbyn will bask in his limelight. Then the Tories, with full DUP support, will drive through Hard Brexit and the DUP will soften the NI border.

I know I seem like a sarcastic Tory loser, but, give it a month and we'll see.

[miasmum]

Osc thank you. As soon as they said she would be doing a deal with the DUP I said to Mr Shell, so loyalists terrorists are ok to fraternise with then? People pillioried Corbyn for daring to even speak to the IRA and now May is climbing into bed with their opposite number

[Workingman]

Brexit harder than it might have been, Suff?

If you listened to the lying Mother bloody Theresa it is now almost impossible. The reason she called the damned election was because she assessed that her hand was not strong enough and she wanted to strengthen it. Well that worked out spectacularly well, did it not?

She now has a weaker hand, so the sort of deal she can come back with is anybody's guess and is not likely to be supported be leavers or remainers alike, but we poor sods will not now get a say in it. It must have been hard work, but she has made Cameron shaking his bit of paper look like a statesman.

At least if she had come out with a 40+ majority we could have probably accepted whatever Brexit deal, but she did not. She, personally, has skewed the Brexit negotiations in the EU's favour and simultaneously thrown the country's internal governance into the blender.

[manxie]

I see a lot of people who are reasonably well off being delighted but as a disabled pensioner myself I fear for the future at basic levels never mind brexit etc the sick, poor, disabled and elderly are all suffering cuts at the hands of the tories.

Nurses are worse of now than they were 8 years ago because of the pitiful 1% pay rises they were awarded for their dedication and devotion............meanwhile the politicians agreed in a majority to award themselves 11% how can that be the actions of a caring government who want to look after their fellow countrymen and women, the tories are well known for lining the pockets of the rich at the expense of the less fortunate, this is nothing new it has been going on for centuries the rich cream off the cash the poor work to keep them and are shown no gratitude.

The NHS is under great pressure with more and more patients requiring care and attention and the government cutting their finances to the bone so much so they can't meet deadlines and patients are the ones who suffer lying on a trolley in a corridor because there are no beds ( not enough staff either) to care for them properly, saying they are spending more than ever on the NHS if fine till you equate it to inflation then you see in reality the NHS is getting less funds than 10 years ago in real terms.

No politician will ever need to rely on the NHS they are all covered privately and can afford to see a specialist/consultant in days if not hours because they can afford to the rest of us wait 18 months to see a consultant as I know in my own experience.

Sadly a lot of politicians are there for the money the status whatever not many are there because they really want to make a difference and help those less well off than themselves.

Manxie xx

[Suff]

but we poor sods will not now get a say in it.

We poor sods just had the biggest, most powerful, say in the working of government any person ever gets. It was a big turnout and, in the end, people voted for confusion, strife and a less certain future. Just as they did in 2010.

You can't blame the politicians for this one. The voters did it and now they have to live with it. The press can say what they like, the people were very well aware what was at stake and they voted for what we have got.

I, for one, am not unhappy with what they have done.

All that had to happen was for UKIP voters to vote Conservative. Instead they felt they could roll back to Labour and still get what they voted for in 2015. Somehow that boggles the mind.

Brexit harder than it might have been, Suff?

Sorry didn't attend to that. I believe that May never really intended to do a very hard Brexit. Which is why she put "disposables" into the position where she could sack them and slide in a softer stance. Now, with the DUP, who campaigned on hard Brexit, in the mix, she is constrained on what she can do and not do. This does not play to a softer Brexit when they coalition with DUP. If you wanted a softer Brexit they would have had to coalition with LD and that was never going to happen.

[Workingman]

Neither of us were talking about the type of Brexit, more the difficulty in negotiating it.

So, where are we?

We have gone from a government with a working majority to one that will climb into bed with terrorist sympathisers from Norn Iron, but the media is keeping that part quiet. We have gone from the possibility of having some say in Brexit negotiations to putting the EU firmly in the driving seat. We have got exatly the opposite of 'strong and stable' government to one constantly on the verge of a no confidence vote. We are in a position where we might need another election in the near future, even as Brexsit negotiations are in full swing. And we have a party of government probably looking for a new leader not far down the line.

And whose fault is it? It is ours, folks, you and me. We pathetic little beings would not vote for a lying, weak, opportunist school ma'am with the looks and personality of a wet baguette. We should be ashamed of ourselves. We really must stop behaving democratically and get back to doing what the press tells us.

[Suff]

And whose fault is it? It is ours, folks, you and me. We pathetic little beings would not vote for a lying, weak, opportunist school ma'am with the looks and personality of a wet baguette. We should be ashamed of ourselves. We really must stop behaving democratically and get back to doing what the press tells us.

Democracy is responsibility. Today we have the result of democracy. Apparently we don't have the responsibility. Strange world. I recall all sorts of calls for a hung parliament. Now we bemoan that we have a hung parliament because it will cause more havoc?

I don't see it that way. Although I am carrying forward my wish, just before the election in response to the polls, that Corbyn had won. He would have been as good for Labour as Brown and Miliband.

Oh well I'm sure it's going to be back to the grindstone shortly. 10 days then we're back on the whole Brexit/EU treadmill. The EU didn't want this any more than the Brits in the middle of the negotiations did. Now they'll try and take advantage and the only defence we have is the word NO. NO == Hard Brexit.

[Workingman]

I do not remember many *calls* for a hung parliament, but I do remember throwing out a few warnings that the Tories would not get remotely near the landslide your dreams and the ultra biased press were predicting.

I had been saying for weeks and months, long before the election call, that Corbyn and Labour had started connecting with the people in ways that made dreams of their demise and the landslide unlikely. I was confident in what I was saying because Leeds regularly gives six of its nine seats to Labour with two of the others flip-flopping Tory/LibDem and Labour/LibDem. I read comments in the local press and listened to phone-ins on local radio and it was obvious that things were far removed form what was on national TV and in the press.

There is a danger in the fallout from all of what has happened today and it does worry me. It is more than likely that May will be removed at some point and that will start off a whole new round of in-fighting in the Tory party, which could take it in any direction. It could be a bloody battle that will not be good for either the party or the country, but we are where we are and all we can do is sit back and watch.

[Suff]

Well I wasn't one who had dreams of a huge Tory majority. In fact I don't really like huge majorities in any party. I did want a slightly larger majority to control the Tory remainer rebels, but that was about it.

If you think back to what I was writing, I said I'd be happy with the same majority and a new manifesto which realigned the Tories.

As for Corbyn "connecting"? It is clear that 2m students registered to vote after the Labour party Manifesto said it would give them free education and not only for those who were signing on for new courses but also for existing students. And they say it's illegal to buy votes....

Students I understand, they don't care what happens to the country so long as they don't have to pay for it. Older adults I would expect to have a slightly higher standard from their government because they have more experience of the cost. Yet I heard McDonnell trotting out Browns mantra of "well I'm only borrowing to invest so that's OK isn't it?" and people, in their droves, voted for it. I'm reminded of the statement "you can please some of the people all of the time".

But the big one for me was when I read about UKIP voters saying that Labour had changed it's stance and was now going to "deliver Brexit". So when the UKIP voters split for Labour I was dismayed but not overly surprised.

Where are we today? Well the Troies must deliver Brexit, closed borders and the removal of the ECJ from the UK legal system. That, if anyone is listening to the EU, is Hard Brexit. The EU will not allow that without exiling the UK without even a trade deal that they give to other countries who do not brook ECJ interference or free movement of people. That is the deal the Tories sold at this election and that is the deal 315 constituencies voted for. So that is what they will deliver.

The uncertainty factor is now, relativley, removed. Tory Remainers were punished, Tory seats in Scotland were voted in on a Brexit platform with a repudiation of Indyref2. Tories have their marching orders and if they don't get on with it they will lose the next election. The HOL is more back in line, as custom says they don't go against the manifesto pledges, although if they want to be flooded with Brexit Tory Lords, then they can start being obnoxiuos.

I'm neither worried nor uncomfortable right now. May will probably be removed in the next 6-9 months. She'll be replaced with someone I probably like more. In fact I'm happier now than I would have been with a Tory Landslide. I still remember the Thatcher and Major years in Scotland and what they did there. A minority government might actually do them some good. It did for Salmond, it did for Cameron.

[Kaz]

Now Sinn Fein are alleging that a coalition between the Tories and DUP contravenes the Good Friday Agreement. This going to be interesting!